Sauce For The Combatant Is Sauce For The Citizen

Of all the stories that caught my attention this last week, the statement by Air Force Secretary Michael Wynne regarding the deployment and testing of non-lethal weapons, offered up the most staggeringly stupid bit of reasoning that we've seen from Bu$hCo in a long time.
The object is basically public relations. Domestic use would make it easier to avoid questions from others about possible safety considerations... If we're not willing to use it here against our fellow citizens, then we should not be willing to use it in a wartime situation. (Because) if I hit somebody with a non-lethal weapon and they claim that it injured them in a way that was not intended, I think that I would be vilified in the world press.
Now...setting aside the fact that Bu$hCo has never been particularly concerned about world opinion, would the Secretary like to explain whom he thinks we should test the weapons on? Protestors, strikers, wild bands of crazed morris dancers? There is a reason that the military is not allowed to act as a police force: Because it engenders a mindset of the citizen as the enemy.

Moreover, it's truly scary to realize that the man at the top of the Air Force is unable to think critically. He's got the consequences observation bass-ackwards. The battlefield, where the death of the target is assumed and anything short of that is an improvement, is exactly where you want to test a new weapon. What?! It's OK to use an RPG because it has no "unintended" consequences. Killing and maiming are assumed...but a new-fangled stun-gun is bad cause you don't know what exactly it'll do?!

But who knows, maybe Bu$hCo is gearing up to relax or circumvent the Posse Comitatus Act, and Wynne's statements designed to set the stage. If there is one thing that Bu$hCo does consistently, it's repeating nonsense so many times that it starts to make sense.


This is just the expected follow up of Cheney shooting a Republican donor and getting away with it. Will the madness never end?
"....it's repeating nonsense so many times that it starts to make sense. As if they weren't scary enough, what we think is nonsense, they see as gospel from day one. John McCain said, in one of the campaigns; "You can make people believe pigs can fly backwards if you say it enough." "Try it on our citizens" is a trial balloon to gauge how long before they can actually do it.
Hey! Glad to see your site pop up. I think they should test it on Cheney first just to see if someone with a heart condition would die. Then they could try it on Bush to see if someone without a heart would die. Bottom line is that the people in Bush's administration don't think they are accountable for anything so anything goes.
TFWY, but relaxing posse comitatus would be pretty egregious and is a much bigger deal than the ethics of non-lethal weapons. Seems that trial balloon on this subject is just asking for trouble.

Peacechick..."see if someone without a heart would die" :-) We could just use the whole administration, right? They sort of act like a mob.

Fashiongirl, not only did he get away with it. The GOP made the poor schmuck apologize!
Non-lethal Nuke Ray.

Coming to a Democratic voting booth near you!
I agree with Mary, cheney would be fair game for a little testin'.

This admin. becomes more frightening every day. Quick, someone put them all in prison before the kill again.
Anti-militarism must have become a reflex on left-leaning blogs. How depressing...

Republicans would NEVER allow this kind of law, as it would only stop them from using these weapons on foreigners. It does not say that these weapons can't be used on demonstrators in the US, only that they shouldn't be used on foreigners unless the US is willing to allow them to be used in the US itself. I think it's a fantastic idea, but it will have to wait until a Democratic administration.

It's unbelievable to see left-leaning bloggers argue that it is just fine to let the Pentagon classify weapons as non-lethal, and thereby allow their use on civilians on foreign soil. Requiring that anything classified as such MUST be accepted by US domestic law enforcement is GREAT!!!
I'm glad these idiots lack the internal sensor most people have to keep their thoughts to themselves. It's just hard to believe that they are THAT crazy.

They are holding 14k people illegally around the world (and torturing them), but they are worried about the international outrage over using a microwave weapon for crowd control? What the hell does the weapon do? Turn people into roast turkey in 5 seconds?
Its not that his continually repeated bs makes sense, its that the general populus eventually buys it as fact..just like propaganda..repeat it often enough and it becomes the truth.
Fortunately, my tin-foil helmet makes me impervious to your evil non-lethal death ray, Lord Cheney!
I think they have their eyes on the Posse Comitatus Act.

I love that no matter what the administration does to make us losee trust in them, it's our fault for being paranoid.
Xsociate...how about a non-lethal "vote" ray? Makes you vote GOP.

PoP, I think that his one is just a plain, "Oops...did I say that out loud." Hopefully isn't indicative of anything.

Endorendil, I don't get your point. What law? I was merely pointing out the sheer blinding stupidity of Secretary Wynne's remarks. I don't even remember the secretary mentioning anything about using the weapons against foreign civilians. Did I miss a memo?
Sothis, Wynne's internal monologue certainly seems to be off.

Dusty, I'm not so sure on this one. I'm with the Station Agent that this might be the opening salvo for an assualt on the Posse Comitatus Act.

LC...as well as your firm belief in the Force.
kvatch, the entire point of the military using non-lethal force is to use it on people without having to certify that they are enemy combatants, i.e. civilians on foreign soil. No one argues that they shouldn't use lethal force on enemy combatants, and no one argues that they should use lethal force on innocent bystanders. But if they had weapons that were both non-lethal and effective, they could (and would) use them all the time, securing buildings, controlling crowds, raiding suspected safehouses, etc, etc, etc. It's a modern military's wet dream: they can shoot all they want, and not have to deal with the consequences of being wrong.

Of course, if the Pentagon declares a weapon non-lethal, do you believe it? As long as they would only use it on foreign soil, no one would be able to sue them. All reports of ill effects would be denied (cfr. their response about the side-effects of using depleted uranium). If they would require these weapons to be certified as non-lethal for use within the US, that would be a huge barrier. One I would applaud.

Also, note that this has absolutely nothing to do with the Posse Comitatus act. The request wasn't to allow the army to test weapons on US civilians, only that the army shouldn't be allowed to use "non-lethal" weapons unless they were accepted as such for use against US civilians. This only puts restrictions on what the US army can use against foreigners, not on what the US police can use against its own citizens. That's why you don't have to worry that this could become a law, as long as the Republicans are in charge.
Funny how it never occurs to them to test it on each other. Why doesn't this guy stand in front of the ray gun and report on its effects?

Posse Comitatus is all but dead unless we can turn control of at least one branch of government over to a second party and even then I expect it to take some heavy shrapnel in the next two years. The White House has been paving the way for martial law since Katrina.
Long Live the Posse Comitatus Act!

I think Bush and Cheney would absolutely LOVE to use the military for law enforcement, all across this great land of ours. Wouldn't anyone who wanted to run their country with an iron fist find that option attractive? Just think what having such a well-equipped police force could do to keep terrorism under control here at home! Why, this might just be the next best thing to martial law (which could follow)! Our military could even be used against dissent! If another terrorist attack doesn't come along for them to use to justify martial law, maybe they can achieve martial law through more gradual means, like circumventing or nullifying Posse Comitatus. If you think it can't happen here, think again... we're closer right now than we have maybe ever been.


As for Wynne, he sounds like a real tool.

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