2007/09/16

The BlognonyPOLL - Emigration

On the anniversary 9/11, I was surprised by the number of readers who expressed serious thoughts of emigration. So now I'd like to formalize the question with a pair of polls:

If America continues on its current course, will you seriously consider emigration?
Yes
No
pollcode.com free polls
If yes, what event might cause you to emigrate?
A Republican president in 2008
A Democrat in 2008 that refuses to end the Iraq War
War with Iran
Formal suspension of habeas corpus
A declaration of martial law
Already making plans
Other
pollcode.com free polls

37 Comments:

I'm pretty sure habeas corpus HAS been suspended. The Jose Padilla case is the clearest proof of that, but some (including a Supreme Court decision) would argue that the inmates of Guantanamo were also supposed to have enjoyed this basic legal protection.

I'm glad to be in Canada but am beginning to believe Station Agent's idea that it isn't far enough. New Zealand maybe? I love mutton.
F#$K no, I'm not leaving. Anyone who invades our country will NOT be greeted as liberators; it doesn't matter if the invader is a foreign army or someone inside the White House. I'll stay here and fight and try to make a difference.

Who Hijacked Our Country
I have thought about it. It is only a couple hour drive to Canada and I am technically a citizen, but I hate to think what the US would look like without at least a bit of progressive influence.
Wowow...I have had this conversation with quite a few people this weekend...so sad...it has come down to stay and fight or leave..
I'm pretty sure habeas corpus HAS been suspended.

SadButTrue...I don't think that this is actually the case. The Hamdan decision didn't actually test the precedent directly.

Tom... Willing to die with the boots on, eh? But to address the issue more directly, is there no point where you'd just say, "It's done, time to save myself and my family?" And I don't in any way take the issue lightly. I'm struggling with the issue myself.
Graeme... It's a good point, but there are many circumstances where progressivism (as well as any other viewpoint the government doesn't like) becomes irrelevant.

E4E... I know what you mean, sort of why I decided to do the poll. I was very surprised by the number of people who responded to my 9/11 post with exactly this sentiment.
I've wanted to move to Canada since 2000, but my family isn't willing to go with me, so I'll be sticking around to fight the good fight.
i hear cuba is pleasant all year round. not to mention, not much infrastructure to destroy in a possible terrorist attack.
I've actually begun to do a bit of research into what would all be involved.

My personal opinion is that my country is dead - and what is replacing it is vile to the extreme.
Lizzy... It's a tough decision, but a question: Do you mean your immediate family or your extended family?

i hear cuba is pleasant all year round.

RAFFI... You mean, except for the hurricanes, right? ;-)

Sewmouse... Let me know what you find out.
I asked this first question at MM a few weeks ago and the results were surprising to me. Most said they had thought about it but probably wouldn't actually leave. If martial law is declared, I am so out of here, if I can go.
I'd like to think I'd stay and fight for what I believe in.
PoP... If the poll results so far are any indication, a number of Blognonymous' readers are seriously considering it. Perhaps my readers are a bit more radical than Morning Martini readers. ;-)

Mary... I'd like to think so too, but after a while you get the sinking feeling that the cause is lost.
I might hit up a Walmart and check out their hunting equipment, but I ain't going anywhere.

My blog's shtick is just that. I think if liberals leave the U.S., the world is effed. Not that it's not effed anyway. Call it effed even worse.
I ain't going nowhere.
Station Agent... The Walmart, huh? Do a lot of hunting? ;-)

Dusty... So let me pose another question: Is it a desire to, "fight the good fight"? A belief that all is not lost? Inertia?
I've thought about it but everywhere else sucks just a little more.

Canada's too cold, Europe's too far, Mexico is too crappy.

So I guess I am just an All American Boy.

Some health insurance would be nice though.
I wish I could say something here. I can't and it sucks.
Hey, where is the box for "Already left nearly a decade ago?"

I hate checking "other".

Maybe I should do a post on what it takes to get legal in the Czech Republic.
Crackpot Press... That is the trick isn't it? Where to go? Where can one find work? It's hard.

I wish I could say something here. I can't and it sucks.

Navyswan... I sympathize. With a family member on active duty, you are almost unique among Blognonymous' readers.

Fred's probably in the same boat.
I'm a fighter...don't believe in quitting...but I think we'll know soon how the wind blows...and I think it is an ill wind. We are in for it I think...I feel we'd be very suppressed...so I would opt out for the sake of my family...this just is not the country it once was. There are other plots of land that can make me happy. Our voices have already been ignored for some time...we need to face that.
Way off topic, but I just saw you in a comcast commercial. If it wasn't you, it was a frog who looked just like you. If you have comcast commercials in your area, watch for this ad.
Praguetwin... That would be great. Post it, let me know, and I'll link to it.

Sumo... It will be interesting if, in the end, Ralph Nader is proven correct about there being no difference between the parties.

PoP... Hey, I'm famous! Of course, not having cable, I guess I'm not likely to see the ad. Bummer!
The frog is large and is identical to your pic. As soon as I saw it today, I told my dog, "Hey, there Kvatch" :)
I love this country. I saw so many like minded weasels this Saturday while standing on a corner behind a protest sign flipping "thumbs up," smiling, and honking in support as they drove past.

I don't believe in wasting my time, smelling their exhaust fumes of support, but 2X/yr I go with my wife who does this weekly.

And always I come away with a sinking feeling of hopelessness. This nation is sooo f*cked, but it has an incredibly wonderful majority of apathetic supporters. May we all get what we deserve so if they we don't leave this place, and they don't kill us under martial law, we'll have many, many years to think about this in dark and dank prison cells (between "recesses" when we are taken out for our torture sessions).
PoP, you shouldn't have brought that up. He's still a little blistered about not getting the Geico gig. If only old man Geico hadn't bought Le Grenouille's shares.
PoP, Robert... That little gecko sh*t, snaked the job right out from under me. And I could'a been a contender!

Dada... Every week? Now that's commitment. Good for your wife! Hopefully we can find some more like her to shake up the preconceptions of the powerful.
Oh, no you don't! All you liberal Euro-Americans don't get to leave Turtle Island unless you take the Right-Wingers WITH you! Don't stick us with being the guards of the asylum.
If I could afford to get my entire family out, I would. But that's the problem. If the monetary system collapsed, then resources would become the next problem.

What I think-
By the time martial law is enacted, nobody is going to get out. The borders will be guarded by 20 something trigger happys with power swollen heads. The slaves will be rounded up and sent to the Rex-84 camps and/or shot & killed.

It would be civil war within a year of the beginning of the round-ups. There will be Montana type militia (across the country without much organization) vs. the pigs, possibly the military and definitely the Blackwater types. And you would have no choice but to participate.

I have to hope it never gets that far. With any luck, the head of the snake will be cut off before it comes to that because it would become worse that "Lord Of The Flies" and truly survival of the fittest. Hopefully our Generals would revolt before all of this.
LC... Don't worry, the second coming is nigh, and the right-wingers are about to be swept up to heaven. Problem solved.

Chuck... True enough. The poll right now is really leaning toward martial law as the impetus, but frankly I shouldn't have included that option. Not only is it the "easy" default, but in that case--as you point out--none of us are leaving.
Great poll, Kvatch.

I'm staying - it would be impossible to even physically talk my family into leaving since they don't see the same threats plus financially it's not possible. There will be no place to run like Chuck points out earlier, sad to say.
We are looking to go to Vancouver, B.C. Canada at some point in the future. One thing that holds me back is I want to stay and fight but I also am getting sick of this fascist country.
Thanks Gracie. The no place to run issue is getting more and more problematic by the day. With the buying power of the dollar plunging just about everywhere, anyone wanting to get out has got some serious issues to deal with.

James... It's the common sentiment I think. After 25 years of Conservatives f*cking liberals every way from Sunday, you just want to take your skills, your assets, and vamoose.
I guess it would take martial law.... But would that be too late?
Yeah, I can't say what I'd do either, but it doesn't envolve leaving. This just might be on the old stereo:

When they kick at your front door
How you gonna come?
With your hands on your head
Or on the trigger of your gun?


The Clash - The guns of brixton
Those who stay behind should probably focus on secession rather than try to reconquer the entire country. The battle lines are pretty much drawn already. I was listening to a San Francisco radio show that discussed how California was doing so much better in energy efficiency than "the United States". So fight for California's independence (or perhaps reunification with Mexico). New England should be easy to break off too. Too bad about Illinois - perhaps it can join Canada?
Nvisiblewmn... Probably. That's why I shouldn't have included it on the poll.

Frederick... spoken like the rebel/military man I did some drinking with a while ago.

Endorendil... Now there's a provocative idea ... secession! I'm all over that. Can we secede from Southern CA while we're at it.

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