Kvatch Konsiders: When 'Gay' Is The Answer
If we had more gay students in our schools, say 50%, we wouldn't have all these problems!
Now...I'm tempted to make this simply a numbers argument--you simply can't bully a group of students that make up 50% of the population--but I feel that I should delve deeper.
Let's start with a premise: Heterosexual high school age boys are louts, crude, rude, socially retarded members of society that, if we weren't so conditioned against cannibalism, we'd probably turn into soylent green and consume. They dress badly, they act badly, they're stupid, and semi-literate. Have you looked into a high-school boy's room lately. AUGGGGGHHHHH! There isn't enough money in the Superfund to clean 'em all up.
But, on the other hand, if 50% of all males were gay, the positive effects would be astounding. Aside from reducing violent outbursts from brawls to shouting matches, "Go away our I shall taunt you a second time..." heterosexual boys would have to dress better--maybe even learn to coordinate an outfit--groom themselves, and maybe...just maybe...learn to relate to women. Because let's face nobody wants to be on the receiving end of a "hag brush-off". "Gee Slash, I'd love to go to a monster truck rally with you, but my best friend Steve is taking me to a revival of Joseph and the Technicolor Dreamcoat."
In short, what I'm trying to say is this: If we want to stem the tide of youth violence in this country, the answer is obvious. We need more gay adolescent males. Nuff said.
How about we force parents to spend more time with their children, since most problem children are lacking in parental supervision? Surely, most parents don't like to tkae the blame for the monsters they have raised, but the truth is babies are born sweet and innocent and only become unruly because of the environment they are raised in.
Meanwhile, no death toll was given. Columbine led to roughly a dozen deaths. All others were less lethal.
It's interesting to consider that white boys were the perpetrators in every case. Why?
Because in most urban settings, you can't easily slip a gun into a school. Thus, if you want death and mayhem, look at urban statistics, paying special attention to the age and race of city killers.
Black and hispanic teenage shooters nail their victims on the streets or at home. Not at school, where they are sure to be caught.
Meanwhile, in contrast to 28 school shootings in almost 28 years committed by white boys, there are at least 28 shootings A WEEK committed by black and hispanic teenagers in this country.
Thus, where does the problem lie? Are white boys really a problem? Are white boys shooting others outside of school? No.
Is the local landscape itself part of the problem? Is it the vacuousness of suburban living that leads to gunplay?
If it is the hum-drum sameness of the suburban existence that leads to the occasional shooting, should parents move to the nearest exciting urban area to ensure their white boys are occupied in wholesome ways?
In New York City, where I live, it's unlikely that calling a white student "gay" would cause the white male student to acquire a weapon and bring it to school.
However, to be called "gay" in the black and hispanic teen culture of this city is a riskier affair. Homophobia is more alive within those two groups.
In the end, it is totally disingenuous to CONSTRUCT a setting in which white boys are the perpetrators of heinous crimes. For one, the problem is easily prevented by keeping guns out of the hands of teenage boys unless a responsible adult is present.
Second, and more important, focusing on these rare events trivializes the extraordinary level of violence among black and hispanic teens. They are casual remorseless killers. And they commit a sizeable percentage of the homicides occurring in this country every year.
To agonize over the causes of the few killings committed by white boys in school suggests the handful of perpetrators and victims are more important than the huge number of black and hispanic teens who are murdered every year. Excessive concern for the white tragedy seems to say that our society expects nothing better from blacks and hispanics, so why worry if they shoot each other on the streets since there's nothing we can do about it anyway.
No_slappz... I'd make the same comment, but I know it would be useless. Tell me though...how do you manage to construe concern for one particular pattern of violence (albeit a smaller, and as you point out, perhaps less tragic pattern) as lack of concern for another?
To agonize over the causes of the few killings committed by white boys in school suggests the handful of perpetrators and victims are more important than the huge number of black and hispanic teens who are murdered every year.
As usual you're making up other people's opinions from whole cloth and then arguing against what was not said.
The testosterone factor is a huge problem with them, not just leading to violence but other forms of cruelty and an all around lack of resect for others.
One thing that would help is if high schools fully funded music and arts programs as much as they do for sports. Teching agression, and not teaching about beauty is a very sad mistake.
Who Hijacked Our Country
Homrmone epidemic? Interesting. Eat right, less screen time and parents don't have kids unless you want to take an interest in them. I'm sure its not that easy.
Competition is not necessarily a bad thing, but as you say, it needs to be tempered with all sorts of other pursuits that we don't pay much attention to these days.
Tom... That's what I'm getting at. How can a jock compare to a man who "understands you".
Mary... Good suggestions, especially that last one about having kids. Course...I should talk, I don't have any.
"No_slappz... I'd make the same comment, but I know it would be useless."
Perhaps you think murder is funny. Based on your flippant post, you do.
Have you personally known any murder victims. Not from afar. But actually known a murder victim? Have you seen the impact on a family? Especially if the victim is a child living at home.
What you fail to see is that your attempt at satire falls flat on a subject like this. It's that simple. There's no way to casually dismiss murder among teenagers.
"Tell me though...how do you manage to construe concern for one particular pattern of violence (albeit a smaller, and as you point out, perhaps less tragic pattern) as lack of concern for another?"
Your pal nvisiblewmn wrote an inane post that attempted to connect teenage homophobic taunting and bullying with the murderous response of the taunted victims.
I can guarantee you that murder crosses the minds of teenagers almost as often as sex. But very few murders occur because very few kids have the means, motive and opportunity to kill the objects of their hatred.
Sex, on the other hand, well, usually there are two interested parties, and neither one goes home dead.
Meanwhile, though virtually all the schoolhouse murders were perpetrated by white male teenagers, that description doesn't go far enough.
The murders were perpetrated by while male teenagers with GUNS.
No guns. No murder. I have no doubt that our annual murder total would explode if all teenagers were armed. Meanwhile, like I mentioned, there are no shootings in NY City public schools because in most high schools kids must pass through more security than travelers at the airport.
Thus, no one is shot at school.
Anyway, despite the near absence of schoolhouse violence in the US, nvisiblewmn is studying this rare social pathology and it moved to post her commentary about it. But her comment reads as though schoolhouse shootings are occurring at epidemic levels.
The idea put forth is that schoolhouse shootings require the focused attention of all parties with an interest in the well being of teenagers. Professionals and parents.
However, in every case, the white teenage boys easily obtained guns. Thus, the only issue of substance is the issue of guns. Not the charged minds of teenage boys.
On the other hand, her post ignores the carnage that occurs among black and hispanic teenagers. But there is no difference in motivations or responses.
When black and hispanic teenagers are "disrespected" they too often shoot each other. They fire away with near abandon in every city in the country.
Thus, claiming a special class of victim/criminal white boys exists is to suggest there is a new social pathology among whites that needs attention. This is totally phony.
We don't allow kids to drink and drive because we know how too many of them will behave. The statistics are painfully evident.
Thus, by the same reasoning, teenagers should not have free access to guns.
Anyway, expending research efforts in this direction trivializes the tragedy in the black and hispanic community. The police in NY City work hard to get guns off the street. We all know teenagers all over the city have guns. We know if they had no guns, the murder rate would fall even further than it has. Yet the simple issue of gun-possession is transmuted into some deep psychological issue when the perps are white kids.
"As usual you're making up other people's opinions from whole cloth and then arguing against what was not said."
You have no capacity for seeing the subtext of people's comments. If you want satire and irony, look again at what people say when they mean to make heartfelt and sympathetic comments. They usuall miss by a mile.
You making fun of me?
No-Slappz, your reading "skills" leave a lot to be desired.
That's why steroid freaks take estrogen inhibitors during the on-cycle, to keep from growing breasts.
Other than that, I take great exception to the characterization of the Invisible Woman's post as "inane." The post itself was observations from an academic peer-reviewed study by two notable researchers.
Is the work of these researchers, then, also "inane?"
Now, it is cited that 2 of these 28 school shootings had a minority as the attacker. Also, it was found to be mainly a suburban phenomenon. There are indeed legitimate inferences that can be drawn from this, notably that of class expectations; but the role of organized crime is not a legitimate inference.
Neglecting the role of organized crime, ie gangs, in the study is only proper. The study dealt with school shootings, not organized crime.
Now, my younger brother missed school one day when he was at a friends house, talking him out of bringing a gun to school. This was in a town of about 600 people, a town with two police officers, one on day shift and the other on nights. No metal detectors. Security is the principal.
A year or two after that, the young man later stole a car and got into a shoot-out with the cops. He spent several years in Las Cruces over that. His brother, Ricky, died in a car wreck the day he was sentenced. He was out driving crazy, taking some of the edge of of his mindless aggression and frustration. Ricky was my friend. He died at 16. It hurts me to even think about it.
Their oldest brother, Ram (Ramos), was the only one to ever graduate high school-- a great achievement for his family. The fellow in the shoot-out got his GED in prison.
Their parents came from Mexico, had very little education, and could speak very little English (the mother could speak none at all).
Why fault the study because my brother was being a friend to his friend, and was able to keep him from bringing the gun to school?
December of '05, my oldest brother was shot on the way home from work. He was working maintenance at the public library through a temp service. He stopped to get a six-pack at the bus stop on his way home, like he did so many times before, and he was shot two blocks away.
That was the Monday before Christmas. I spent all week wondering if my brother would live or not.
Still, it has nothing to do with libraries-- or schools either.
You're not going to seriously suggest that a post about the loutishness of adolescent boys (you did get that part right?) implies the following nonsense:
Perhaps you think murder is funny. Based on your flippant post, you do.
Regardless of where I got the idea, the post remains what it is, a satirical poke at homophobia and stupidity in adolescent boys.
Sometimes no_slappz, despite your desperation for it to be otherwise, a spade is still just a spade.
Robert... I guess the interesting question is, how do we accomplish that. Lew's probably got the right idea: parental involvement.
Let's Talk... Not sure what you're getting at. Though I suspect that my attitude would actually be vaguely insulting to many of my gay friends.
Nvisiblewmn... "Queer eye for the High School Guy"! I love it!
ProgressiveT... Your point about the pedigree and focus of the studies is a good one. Though I doubt no_slappz will give an inch over that.
Hey...while we're on the subject...Las Cruces? That's right up the road from my hometown, El Paso.
Head to Cruces, take a right, and when you come down out of the mountains, that's my old stomping grounds (and I did do some pretty good stomping there...).
Called Llano Estacado, the Caprock, and the Permian Basin. Not really sure what the difference is. Largest mesa in the world.
Fished the Pecos, south of Carlsbad mostly, around Malaga. A place called Black River they stock with trout. White bass run at Red Bluffs where the Pecos enters Texas.
Was last there for Christmas, sometime in the early '90s.
I love the desert, and a part of it will always be a part of me.
I'm sure nvisiblewmn could too.
She chose to talk about another form of violence among youth. I read her excellent post and nowhere did I hear her discount the problems in our inner cities.
Just because we're devoting some time and space to one issue doesn't mean we're ignoring the other.
Inane? We must not have been reading the same post.
ProgressiveT... When I was a kid, I used to do a lot of hiking both in the mountains west of Las Cruces and in the Carlsbad area. White Sands was a hangout for me and my friends. Skiing in the mountains around Ruidoso. [sigh]
What are all the heterosexual girls supposed to do?
Tree... What are you kidding? Unless one's goal is to get laid on prom night, imagine the advantages of going with your gay friend. He'll dress better. He'll dance better. He'll be polite, courteous, considerate, stylish. What more could you ask for? ;-)
There is no question that you can't solve the problem of teen violence with simple solutions. Homosexuals can be as cruel to each other and to heterosexuals as anybody.
Nvisiblewmn... Now that's a good point--a friend who'll look great on prom night and who can help you look great too! ;-)
Hell - NOBODY in there wanted to hit on us!! But EVERYBODY wanted to dance with us - and did! *grin*
I had more fun in those bars with the boys than I ever had in a straight bar where asking a girl to dance was apparently the moral equivalent of a formal proposal of matrimony - given the number of offers to worship Terpsicore I received there.
AFAIK, owning a gun (and shooting it at red people or occasional white people who try to take your liberty and pursuit of happiness away) is something granted by the Constitution. Now I know your president considers it a god damn piece of paper, but do show some respect, huh? :)
And I would wage a guess that most gun related homicides are not random, but directed at specific persons. As long as these people are killing each other, we all win.
"AFAIK, owning a gun (and shooting it at red people or occasional white people who try to take your liberty and pursuit of happiness away) is something granted by the Constitution."
Yeah, if the other guy is threatening you with a deadly weapon. But if he's carrying only a ball-point pen and you blast him with your .44, things might not go your way in court.
"And I would wage a guess that most gun related homicides are not random, but directed at specific persons. As long as these people are killing each other, we all win."
Yes, there are some "public service" homicides. Few tears are shed when violent felons are killed by other violent felons. Though usually there is a mother present to wail that her son was an honor student and didn't deserve to die even though he was attempting to murder another neighborhood honor student.
Anyway, it's an oversimplification to think that all scores with society are settled because one bad guy kills another bad guy. The facts show that plenty of victims were not candidates for death row, even if they weren't society's most honest and reputable members.
Meanwhile, in my own personal experience, every murder victim I've known, and the number is unfortunately large, every victim except two were decent people.
The world is not better for their untimely departures.
I just spoke to God. He said that his plan for the planet was a forty per cent reduction in homo sapiens to three point eight billion inhabitants, you know, global warming, famines and all that shit.
Part of the math was the 'how many babies per couple?' formula.
This turns out to be one point two six children per do-it-yourself couple planet wide.
This takes getting a whole bunch of weenies and vaginee parts to leave each other alone.
Ergo, he said, I'm going to crank up production of my weenies of mis direction children , or WMDs as the Neo-Theos call them until at such time that the planet's CO2, oxygen, food, water, etc return to homeostasis. This I call 'harmony with the divine.'
Actually, I sent Mr. Darwin down to sort of explain it all, but that's another story.
Speaking of other stories, Mr. Kvatch on his blognonymous website gets a gold star for his comments on the need for and the long term benefits from non reproductive sexual behavior.
Given his well honed sense of humor, may I ever so deliciously point out to him that if the NeoTheos and Big Benny forwent the skinny dipping good, Papal Penii Protection Bad Proclamations and pedalled condoms worldwide like their bigoted, capalist, money grubbing asses were falling off I would not have to alter your planet's sexual mores for, hmm, let me see, I've got my notes right here, the next thirty one thousand years.
"Christ, is that right? Thirty one thousand.....?"
Romunov... Very...uh..."socially darwinian" there, Romunov.
TomCat... Heh, heh! :-)
We all know that kids catch gay from the TVs and interwebnets
Scott... You got that right! Gay/Liberal/Feminazi agenda it is!
BTW: Like the Survivor idea.